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TrulyRaNd0m is not online. Last active: 4/17/2011 7:39:22 PM TrulyRaNd0m
trulyrand0m.livejournal.com
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Joined: 14 Jan 2006
Total Posts: 2250
 
Two HORSE hands for discussion...
Posted: 08-31-2007 03:42 AM
First we'll start with a Stud Hi/Lo hand...

*** 3rd STREET ***
Dealt to Delt_Magoo22 [8s]
Dealt to anarchman [9s]
Dealt to TrulyRaNd0m [5d Ad 4d]
Dealt to scottlylal [Kd]
Dealt to ViennaNights [3c]
Dealt to KingKong28 [Jh]
Dealt to 66Skippy66 [7h]
ViennaNights: brings in for $1
KingKong28: calls $1
66Skippy66: folds
Delt_Magoo22: calls $1
anarchman: folds
TrulyRaNd0m: raises $1 to $2
scottlylal: folds
ViennaNights: calls $1
KingKong28: calls $1
Delt_Magoo22: calls $1
*** 4th STREET ***
Dealt to Delt_Magoo22 [8s] [Th]
Dealt to TrulyRaNd0m [5d Ad 4d] [4c]
Dealt to ViennaNights [3c] [9c]
Dealt to KingKong28 [Jh] [6c]
TrulyRaNd0m: bets $2
ViennaNights: calls $2
KingKong28: calls $2
Delt_Magoo22: calls $2
*** 5th STREET ***
Dealt to Delt_Magoo22 [8s Th] [5h]
Dealt to TrulyRaNd0m [5d Ad 4d 4c] [8d]
Dealt to ViennaNights [3c 9c] [5c]
Dealt to KingKong28 [Jh 6c] [Jd]
KingKong28: bets $4
Delt_Magoo22: calls $4
TrulyRaNd0m: raises $4 to $8
ViennaNights: calls $8
KingKong28: folds
Delt_Magoo22: calls $4
*** 6th STREET ***
Dealt to Delt_Magoo22 [8s Th 5h] [6s]
Dealt to TrulyRaNd0m [5d Ad 4d 4c 8d] [2d]
Dealt to ViennaNights [3c 9c 5c] [7c]
TrulyRaNd0m: bets $4
ViennaNights: raises $4 to $8
Delt_Magoo22: calls $8
TrulyRaNd0m: raises $4 to $12
ViennaNights: calls $4
Delt_Magoo22: calls $4
*** RIVER ***
Dealt to TrulyRaNd0m [5d Ad 4d 4c 8d 2d] [Td]
TrulyRaNd0m: bets $4
ViennaNights: calls $4
Delt_Magoo22: calls $4
*** SHOW DOWN ***
TrulyRaNd0m: shows [5d Ad 4d 4c 8d 2d Td] (HI: a flush, Ace high; LO: 8,5,4,2,A)
ViennaNights: mucks hand
Delt_Magoo22: mucks hand
aaron18D joins the table at seat #2
Delt_Magoo22 said, "nh"
TrulyRaNd0m collected $45.50 from pot
TrulyRaNd0m collected $45.25 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $93.75 | Rake $3
Seat 1: Delt_Magoo22 (button) mucked [4s 2s 8s Th 5h 6s 5s]
Seat 3: anarchman folded on the 3rd Street (didn't bet)
Seat 4: TrulyRaNd0m showed [5d Ad 4d 4c 8d 2d Td] and won ($90.75) with HI: a flush, Ace high; LO: 8,5,4,2,A
Seat 5: scottlylal folded on the 3rd Street (didn't bet)
Seat 6: ViennaNights mucked [3h 2c 3c 9c 5c 7c 2h]
Seat 7: KingKong28 folded on the 5th Street
Seat 8: 66Skippy66 folded on the 3rd Street (didn't bet)

I think this hand played itself. Was I correct to jam every street like I did? Is this standard Stud Hi/Lo play? I'm still working on my Stud and Stud 8/b games so I was wondering if this was played too aggressively or not.

This next hand I'm pretty proud of...

*** 3rd STREET ***
Dealt to Delt_Magoo22 [9d]
Dealt to anarchman [Td]
Dealt to TrulyRaNd0m [6d As 7h]
Dealt to scottlylal [Tc]
Dealt to ViennaNights [2d]
Dealt to insidejob [3h]
Dealt to 66Skippy66 [Kd]
66Skippy66: brings in for $1
Delt_Magoo22: calls $1
anarchman: folds
TrulyRaNd0m: raises $1 to $2
scottlylal: folds
ViennaNights: raises $2 to $4
insidejob: raises $2 to $6
66Skippy66: folds
Delt_Magoo22: folds
TrulyRaNd0m: calls $4
ViennaNights: raises $2 to $8
Betting is capped
insidejob: calls $2
TrulyRaNd0m: calls $2
*** 4th STREET ***
Dealt to TrulyRaNd0m [6d As 7h] [Qd]
Dealt to ViennaNights [2d] [Th]
Dealt to insidejob [3h] [Kh]
ViennaNights: bets $2
insidejob: calls $2
TrulyRaNd0m: calls $2
*** 5th STREET ***
Dealt to TrulyRaNd0m [6d As 7h Qd] [2c]
Dealt to ViennaNights [2d Th] [8h]
Dealt to insidejob [3h Kh] [7c]
ViennaNights: bets $4
insidejob: raises $4 to $8
TrulyRaNd0m: calls $8
ViennaNights: calls $4
*** 6th STREET ***
Dealt to TrulyRaNd0m [6d As 7h Qd 2c] [4s]
Dealt to ViennaNights [2d Th 8h] [Ts]
Dealt to insidejob [3h Kh 7c] [Qs]
TrulyRaNd0m: bets $4
ViennaNights: calls $4
insidejob: raises $4 to $8
TrulyRaNd0m: calls $4
ViennaNights: calls $4
*** RIVER ***
Dealt to TrulyRaNd0m [6d As 7h Qd 2c 4s] [Js]
TrulyRaNd0m: bets $4
ViennaNights: calls $4
insidejob: raises $4 to $8
TrulyRaNd0m: calls $4
ViennaNights: calls $4
*** SHOW DOWN ***
insidejob: shows [2h 6s 3h Kh 7c Qs 5s] (Lo: 7,6,5,3,2)
TrulyRaNd0m: shows [6d As 7h Qd 2c 4s Js] (Lo: 7,6,4,2,A)
ViennaNights: mucks hand
TrulyRaNd0m collected $102.75 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $105.75 | Rake $3
Seat 1: Delt_Magoo22 (button) folded on the 3rd Street
Seat 3: anarchman folded on the 3rd Street (didn't bet)
Seat 4: TrulyRaNd0m showed [6d As 7h Qd 2c 4s Js] and won ($102.75) with Lo: 7,6,4,2,A
Seat 5: scottlylal folded on the 3rd Street (didn't bet)
Seat 6: ViennaNights mucked [7d Ah 2d Th 8h Ts 4c]
Seat 7: insidejob showed [2h 6s 3h Kh 7c Qs 5s] and lost with Lo: 7,6,5,3,2
Seat 8: 66Skippy66 folded on the 3rd Street

To summarize...

Third street play: Obviously 76A is a really good starting hand for Razz. I don't mind getting it in a capped pot here when all I know is they have low door cards.

Fourth street: Obviously the Queen is a bad card. But both of them got nasty cards too, and I think the pot's too big to fold here.

Fifth street: At this point, I feel really good about my hand. I'm drawing to a 76 low... meanwhile, I can safely deduce Vienna is now behind me, drawing to an 8 low... insidejob is the only guy I have to worry about, who is drawing to some sort of 7 low, possibly a better one than me. I don't see how folding here would be an option, when I'm definitely ahead of the one guy and possibly ahead of the other.

Sixth street: I actually misplayed this street in retrospect. I had the best hand at that point. Vienna was drawing dead and calling down anyway. insidejob was obviously still on the draw, and could even be drawing dead. I should've reraised here.

Seventh: I realized on seventh I made a mistake on sixth, and felt like this was a situation where I couldn't miss a bet. I know I'm ahead of Vienna, and unless I got very unlucky I have insidejob beat too.

Any thoughts on these hands? I'm tryiing to get into HORSE again... and I have a lot of rough spots in my Stud games. Btw, this was 2/4 HORSE.

- TR



"I'm not a 'roll' model."

Check out my blog, I'm updating again. http://trulyrand0m.livejournal.com
bobby7 is not online. Last active: 8/30/2011 6:55:21 AM bobby7
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Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Total Posts: 5426
 
Re: Two HORSE hands for discussion...
Posted: 08-31-2007 04:18 AM
hand 1

3rd street, very standard raise, you have the 2nd best possiblte starting hand in a suited A-5, only rolled up trips beat it.

4th street, im gonna bet if i catch any low card even if it pairs me or another diamond. i check/call anything else.

5th street, this is a close decision but based on the other hands a raise is right, only vienna can have a better low draw than you right now but even if he does you got the diamonds..it also looks like he may have a club draw and you may beat him flush over flush, someone just paired meaning they could have trips..they may be very confident in their hand so you want to get some money in here, however if i was 3bet i would just call because that means he has the trips..meaning a flush may not win.

if the other boards contained more low cards i favor a call since you are drawing to an 8 low..but as the cards lie i like a raise.

6th street and 7th street, bet/raise anything.

i dont think you missed any bets here.
----------------------------------------

as for the razz hands, razz hands tend to play themselves a lot.

3rd street, you obviously have to call this on 3rd, i dont like having to call 4 bets with it but im never folding this here.

4th street, standard call

5th street, inside is telling you he has a 7 high draw, based on the pot size its correct even though you clearly know your drawing to a worse hand than he is.

6th street, you missed a raise, you have them board locked neither of them can have you beat right now, it is now VERY obvious what insides hand is..and he is wrong for making this raise here. you hold a rough 7 so he figures to win with a 7 low..that means he has at most 12 outs to win so his raise here is incorrect so you need to punish him for making this mistake by 3 betting.

7th street, even though you missed a raise i feel calling is correct here, your opponent is showing 73 and is willing to raise you here, he has to have a 7 low he would just call with an 8. you do not beat very many 7 lows, the only 7 low you can beat is a 765 and seeing as how you cant see either the 6 or the 5 its hard to know if it holds them, i actually expect to lose this hand most of the time here so i must just call. also it helps that you have another dead bet from vienna coming, however i would say just calling is correct even without vienna in the pot.

refering to what your opponent did on 6th street, this is a common mistake i see at razz, people will bet/raise a drawing hand even on 6th street when its now not the right play. it is the correct play to raise good draws when your opponent is drawing to a worse hand or is holding a rough 9 or 10 low because then over half the deck would give you the winner making a raise mathematically correct but you are holding a 7 low and are likely duplicating some of his outs, so many people dont understand this concept and is how a lot of money is lost by bad players, they go nuts with any good low draw, in razz probably more than any other game it matters what your opponents cards are and not so much your own, there are times when a queen low is clearly the best hand and you should jam it, there are times when you have to release a 7-8 low it all depends on what you see on the board, far too many players only play there own cards and playing only your own cards is a quick way to go broke in razz.

the only mistake you made in these hands was on 6th street in the razz hand when you i guess didnt notice you had them boardlocked, razz hands do play themselves but i always like to take an extra second to consider what hands i can beat and what i cant during a razz hand, i probably play my razz hands slower than any other game because i just dont want to make a silly mistake. the correct play is often SO obvious in razz that its actually easy to overlook it if you play too fast.


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