 TonyD
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| Joined: 18 Oct 2005 |
| Total Posts: 126 |
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Middle pairs - problem?
Posted: 09-20-2006 07:16 PM |
Something I seem to be running across lately.
When I play with middle pairs and hit a set I'm finding a lot of times the card has also helped someone else make a straight. I've had this recently with jacks, 10s and 9s (the one I just had - 10 on the flop [checked], 9 on the turn, jack on the river to give 87suited his flush).
Does anyone else see this occuring or is this just a peculiar phase I seem to be seeing? |
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sdocy
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| Joined: 30 Jul 2006 |
| Total Posts: 49 |
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Re: Middle pairs - problem?
Posted: 09-20-2006 07:52 PM |
Your problem is maybe you are slow playing the set too much. While I certainly understand where you are coming from, I love to slow play em too, you need to up the agression factor if draws start to appear. A set is by no means an unbeatable hand. Though with a flush or straight on the flop, you of course don't need to be completely fearful, as you still have a good chance of boating. Can you say "gimme your stack"?
About the only time I completely slow play a set is when someone else re-raised pre-flop. I like to let them hang themselves. Even then, I will still start firing away if they are too passive or the board gets ugly.
I generally try to play a set like I would top pair, top kicker, but without showing too much fear of holding second best hand. You get people thinking thats all you have and you generally get some action.
stephen
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bobby7
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| Joined: 05 Apr 2004 |
| Total Posts: 5345 |
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Re: Middle pairs - problem?
Posted: 09-21-2006 08:25 PM |
too many people slowplay way way too much, i find that i very often save money because someone slowplayed. for instance ill never forget one time where this chatterbox was talking crap to everyone and i have flopped a set of 3s on a 345 board and the turn and river are big cards, on the river he makes only a minraise and flips over a wheel and he goes on to say how hes the best and whatnot and im like thanks you saved me $30 i was calling an all-in at anytime. i may have lost the hand but i was pleased with the result. there is absolutely no reason to slowplay there, your opponent bets just go ahead and raise. the main reason slowplaying is risky is because if you wait till the turn or river to raise its a dead giveaway you hit something unless your making a play.
there needs to be a reason to slowplay a hand, you dont just slowplay because you flopped a big hand. into someone who raised preflop and keeps betting then hell yeah ill call until he slows down. if my opponent is super tight ill check to hope he hits something and then make a big bet on the turn or river and hope he calls but other than that i dont, those 2 examples are times when a slowplay is best because the aggressive player will halt when you show strength and the tight player will run away when you show strength.
one time i got a straightflush on the turn and i just went all-in for over the pot size because i felt my opponent had a flush and he did, why should i slowplay that? just because i have a big hand? no thats not how it works. sometimes i wont even slowplay a straight flush but i have on many occasions slowplayed top pair and even middle pair because i needed to let him catch up a bit to get a couple more dollars out.
the golden rule of slowplaying is you do it when you feel you otherwise wouldnt get action. THE STRENGTH OF YOUR HAND DOES NOT MATTER. when i slowplay hands like top and 2nd pair its when its a big card and i feel hes drawing near dead on the turn.
sets are a NL players' most profitable hand, im willing to bust with a set because ill be the dominant favorite the vast majority of the time. if i have a set and there is no flush possible or 4 card straight out then ill put all the money almost everytime and live with the results, if i die by a straight then it is bad luck, almost every single player will play top 2 pair the same as a straight so you really cant fear straights when you have a set |
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TonyD
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| Joined: 18 Oct 2005 |
| Total Posts: 126 |
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Re: Middle pairs - problem?
Posted: 09-22-2006 02:38 PM |
| I should have added, I don't slow play sets. I'm raising and re-raising nearly all the time, the only exception might be if the flop comes down all one suit and there are multiple players seeing the flop. |
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sdocy
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| Joined: 30 Jul 2006 |
| Total Posts: 49 |
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Re: Middle pairs - problem?
Posted: 09-22-2006 04:12 PM |
Ahh, from your description, it sounded like you were playing fairly passive on that hand.
If you are playing the hand agressively and not giving the villain proper pot odds to chase his draw, then you should come out ahead in the long run so don't worry about the times when they are able to get there. The only thing I can think of is that they probably have better implied odds when you have a set compared to when you just have TPTK, since it is harder to lay down a set to a raise if a scare card hits.
Possibly keep notes on the players who consistently pay pot sized bets while on the draw and make them pay twice as much next time. Though I still think it should be profitable to let them chase for the proper bet-size, particularly with your chance of hitting a full house when they hit their flush.
stephen
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